BREASTFEEDING AND AIDS IN AFRICA

Question:

BREASTFEEDING AND AIDS IN AFRICA By Roberto Giraldo June 2000 For more than a decade publications have been addressing the possibility that AIDS can be transmitted through breastfeeding. The United Nations’ agencies UNAIDS, UNICEF, and WHO have suggested HIV-positive mother stop breastfeeding to avoid the transmission of HIV/AIDS from mother to child.

Any way they can get third world mothers to stop breastfeeding–they are going to try—that ploy kills 1.5 million from dirty water already

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So true.

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BREASTFEEDING AND AIDS IN AFRICA By Roberto Giraldo June 2000 For more than a decade publications have been addressing the possibility that AIDS can be transmitted through breastfeeding. The United Nations

How to get my baby back on track

Question:

Hi – Here’s a sequence you can attempt: First, measure exactly how much milk/formula your baby is taking every day by bottle.  After you’ve done this for a few days, so you have a sense of how much your baby is actually taking by bottle, start offering bottle first, then breast (with SNS or equivalent) right after.  That is, the bottle quenches the fiercest hunger pains, and then the breast is right there.  If you can get to your baby BEFORE she’s hungry, then offer the breast first. Every suckle she takes from the breast is good.  Now, your goal is to decrease the amount by bottle and increase the amount by breast.  You can either wait for a growth spurt, when she’s hungry far more often, and NOT increase the ounces by bottle, or else you can decrease the amount by bottle by 1 ounce every 3 days.  (You should do that eventually, anyway.) You may also wish to use a nipple shield.  It makes the breast "feel" more bottle-like for some babies, and although it’s a nuisance and you’ll eventually want to get rid of it, it may help with the transition. Do keep a close watch on the wet and poopy diapers.  Getting nutrition of any sort is far more important than getting breastmilk in particular. You may or may not succeed in getting your baby back to the breast.  If you do not succeed, don’t fret too much.  You still have a beautiful baby, and this little setback will get you used to her piered eybrow when she’s a teenager. Best of luck, –Beth Kevles   http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html — a page for the milk-allergic   Disclaimer:  Nothing in this message should be construed as medical   advice.  Please consult with your own medical practicioner.

Response:

Just a little note to Richard and Lily. I’ve been watching your struggle and Richard you have no idea how much your support and encouragement, not to mention the time in the trenches feeding your precious baby, can mean to a struggling new mother. My DD’s father (another Richard, who is over 50 too) made the comment, "well, I guess she is just going to be a bottle baby." He said this while I was in bed trying to get my squirming, crying baby to my full, painful breast. We have moved beyond that now, but at the time I wailed and wailed feeling devastated and an absolute failure. You are a shining example of what love and commitment mean. Glad to hear Lily’s supply is overflowing. You wouldn’t believe how fast that stockpile in the freezer can disappear! Sending calming vibes your way ~~~~~~ Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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Just a hint about the Avent bottles that drip. I too was frustrated with them in the childcare center I worked. The trick is to tighten the until they make ‘pop’ sound and then loosen about an 1/8 – 1/4 turn. For some strange reason this will seal the bottle and prevent leaking. Becky

I went through something similar with my first.  After the birth, I had hemorraging, and lost quite a bit of blood.  My son was born two weeks early, and was very sleepy.  We ended up going the same route with him as this one, but he never ever latched on.  And, with the pump we rented from the hospital, I never gave out more than 2 oz of milk at a time.  We tried the finger feeding method, but then he wouldn’t take the breast (or a bottle either).  We tried the SNS system, but he was already rejecting breasts by then.  We tried the Avent bottles, but the ones we got dripped if turned upside down, so that was counter-productive.  The Vent-air bottles with the stage 1 nipple are very slow flow, but the shape is the normal bottle nipple shape.  (And, by the time we noticed that with the first baby, he was on bottles full time.) I felt the same way you did, but I couldn’t keep up with it for that long. Between my fatigue from anemia, and my emotional state after my son rejecting my breasts, I decided to go with bottle feeding after two weeks of fighting.  He did just fine with it, but I really did want to breast feed him, so it was always a source of disappointment. I wish you the best of luck.  I am going to be trying Marvel’s suggesting of just using a syringe after the breast starting tomorrow. I do have a Medela Classic now.  It is a very nice pump, and my production is doing well.  I just need to slip in extra pumpings to boost production to store. Jackie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Jackie, we are in a very similar situation.  Our baby is 3w+2d today. After a wonderful vaginal birth (zero med) which greatly exceeded our expectations, she was readmitted at 3 days for elevated bilirubin (at 14.7 mg/dL, not really elevated, we later learned) and excessive weight loss.  She had eaten nothing since birth; her discharge weight, at age 60 hours, was 12% below her birth weight — a loss of over a pound (454g).  In the hospital, against my wishes (unfortunately, I didn’t give a direct order), she was given formula by bottle. We have been pumping, feeding her only breast milk.  We rented a Medela Classic, and found that using it has increased my wife, Lily’s milk production significantly.  We’re stockpiling breast milk in our freezer (in fact, on today’s To-Do list is the purchase of additional storage bags).  If you use a hospital-grade pump (Medela Classic or Medela Lactina, for example), your production will increase.  Mid-grade pumps (Medela Pump In Style) will keep your production from falling, but won’t increase it much. [Disclaimer: I have nothing to gain by your using Medela pumps; I mention them only because they are the only ones familiar to me.] Two of our lacation consultants (we’ve seen SIX!) recommended using the Avent bottle/nipple, because of the dome base, which will keep her jaw open and lips flared.  We have used an SNS and a Hazelbaker finger feeder. This poor child has had every type of feeding apparatus imagineable in her mouth. Feeding is a time of frustration and tears for us.  We feed her a little, because if she is too hungry, she only cries at the breast, then have her try at the breast.  She cries and squirms, Lily struggles to keep her resolve, and I offer encouragement, feel frustrated at my inability to offer any real help, and simply hope for the best.  These past couple of weeks have been hell. I’m sorry, but clearly, I’m in no position to offer you advice.  I offer you my encouragement and very best wishes. Richard : I have a ten day old girl who was a sleepy baby.  Of course, the hospital : had us supplement her with formula there, and the lactation consultant : reccomended that we try her at each breast 15 minutes and then move on to : the bottle at each feeding. : She only latched on maybe five times total, and then she started rejecting : the breast entirely.  She would fight being pushed into it, and cry harder. : I didn’t want to get her totally turned off to the breasts, so I backed off : for a while, and posted my problems to the La Leche Leauge.  However, in the : five or six days since my question, I have not had any answers, and she is : getting more and more fixed on the plastic nipple. : Right now I am pumping 95% of the milk she drinks, but this is not going to : last.  Eventually, her appetite will outpace my production. : Help! : Jackie

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After reading Richard and Lily’s story I think my DD’s mouth was too small also.

I had this problem, too.  With all three of my babies.  My last one, while a good nurser, just couldn’t get on far enough for a good seal so was taking in as much air as milk!  YIKES! Has anyone checked for a short frenulin?  I always checked this when someone said the baby’s mouth was too small.  My second had this problem – his tongue just couldn’t come over his lower gum – and it wasn’t discovered until three weeks of cracked bleeding nipples and fighting him to nurse!  Whew!  once we had it snipped, the relief on my nipples was phenomenal! Take care and good luck. Darla Homeschooling Mom to Freya, Alec, and Kelson! Wife to Jim.

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Oh my goodness Darla! Nobody suggested it to me at the time, but if I have another child, you can bet I’m getting second and third and FOURTH opinions about that possibility! Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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GREAT NEWS!!! I’m so glad to hear it. Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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Richard and Lily, Micaela is a lucky girl to have parents like you two! Glad to hear that she is gaining well and you have optimism for her latching on properly. Sounds like that could be anytime within the next week! Crossing fingers, Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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Thanks so much, Marvel!  Hearing words like yours really helps us keep going! The next week would be WONDERFUL!! Richard and Lily

: Richard and Lily, : : Micaela is a lucky girl to have parents like you two! Glad to hear that she : is gaining well and you have optimism for her latching on properly. Sounds : like that could be anytime within the next week! : : Crossing fingers, : Marvel : Join my breastfeeding group! : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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I want to add, too, Marvel, that I’m truly sorry you had such a rough time with your DD.  I can truly sympathize with you. We have a friend whose mother scolded her (!) for not having milk at day 3 (you’d think she’d remember herself!), and whose husband screamed at her, "What are you trying to do, starve my daughter?" No woman should ever feel a failure because of a breastfeeding problem, unless she is able to breastfeed and chooses to formula feed for "convenience".  Then she has every right to consider herself a failure. Anyay, I’m not good, others are bad. : Sending calming vibes your way ~~~~~~ Thanks so much.  They feel good!! And we can really use them! Richard

: Just a little note to Richard and Lily. : : I’ve been watching your struggle and Richard you have no idea how much your : support and encouragement, not to mention the time in the trenches feeding : your precious baby, can mean to a struggling new mother. : : My DD’s father (another Richard, who is over 50 too) made the comment, : "well, I guess she is just going to be a bottle baby." He said this while : I was in bed trying to get my squirming, crying baby to my full, painful : breast. We have moved beyond that now, but at the time I wailed and wailed : feeling devastated and an absolute failure. : : You are a shining example of what love and commitment mean. Glad to hear : Lily’s supply is overflowing. You wouldn’t believe how fast that stockpile in : the freezer can disappear! : : Sending calming vibes your way ~~~~~~ : Marvel : Join my breastfeeding group! : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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Thank you, oh so much, Marvel.  You can’t know how much words like yours mean at a time like this.  We are so totally absorbed in trying to give Miceala what is best for her, it’s easy to lose perspective.  We look from feeding to feeding, wishing we could give her a more pleasant experience at meal time. We think she started her three-week growth spurt this morning (she’s 3w+3d today).  She just kept chugging and chugging — ended up taking over 4 oz, a new high.  With luck, some of that nutrition will end up growing her jaw and mouth a bit larger so she won’t have such a hard time latching. Last night I read about some babies who spontaneously started latching perfectly at age 5 weeks and 6 weeks, and one at 3 months (!! can we hold on that long??), so we still are hoping she’ll get the hang of it once she is a bit bigger. At least she is doing well, albeit on bottles (Avent).  She is feeding on 100% breast milk and is putting on weight rapidly.  We’re trying to be optimistic.  Your kind thoughts help, and we truly appreciate your gracious words. Richard and Lily

: Just a little note to Richard and Lily. : I’ve been watching your struggle and Richard you have no idea how much your : support and encouragement, not to mention the time in the trenches feeding your : precious baby, can mean to a struggling new mother. : My DD’s father (another Richard, who is over 50 too) made the comment, "well, I : guess she is just going to be a bottle baby." He said this while I was in bed : trying to get my squirming, crying baby to my full, painful breast. We have : moved beyond that now, but at the time I wailed and wailed feeling devastated : and an absolute failure. : You are a shining example of what love and commitment mean. Glad to hear Lily’s : supply is overflowing. You wouldn’t believe how fast that stockpile in the : freezer can disappear! : Sending calming vibes your way ~~~~~~ : Marvel : Join my breastfeeding group! : http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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I have a ten day old girl who was a sleepy baby.  Of course, the hospital had us supplement her with formula there, and the lactation consultant reccomended that we try her at each breast 15 minutes and then move on to the bottle at each feeding. She only latched on maybe five times total, and then she started rejecting the breast entirely.  She would fight being pushed into it, and cry harder. I didn’t want to get her totally turned off to the breasts, so I backed off for a while, and posted my problems to the La Leche Leauge.  However, in the five or six days since my question, I have not had any answers, and she is getting more and more fixed on the plastic nipple. Right now I am pumping 95% of the milk she drinks, but this is not going to last.  Eventually, her appetite will outpace my production. Help! Jackie

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You’re right.  After that last post, she’s been feeding three out of four times on the breast! Some of her problem was that she wasn’t latching on properly, and was getting frustrated.  Now, she’s getting it right most of the time.  When she doesn’t breast feed, even after I feed her 2 oz. of EBM, she’s still fussing like she’s not satisfied.  So, it is a reinforcement to both of us to get her to breast feed. She is feeding only on my left breast right now.  Which is strange, because my right one produces twice as much milk.  I’ll let her get good at latching on before I move her over.  Like you said, at least she’s nursing.  My left one does produce enough milk for her by itself.  I’m just taking the opportunity to stockpile the stuff from the right. Sounds like you had an amazing fight.  I wish I had found these forums twenty months ago when I was going through a similar fight with my son.  It would have done me a world of good to hear people to be successful after the baby being bottle fed for so long. I will post as things progress.  She’s fooled me before, and might backslide. Jackie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Yes, Jackie I did, but it got progressively better day by day. From entirely eating EBM/formula to only EBM to one nursing session to two nursing sessions and so on. My DD didn’t have a poor suck, she had a fierce one! YIKES! After reading Richard and Lily’s story I think my DD’s mouth was too small also. My pain and her poor latch. We came home from the hospital on day 4 of her life and my nipples were cracked and bleeding, then my milk didn’t come in until like day 6.  The second week of her life I mostly fed her by bottle (fomula and EBM). I was given breast shields to use but she took the bare breast better than the shielded nipple, so I just gave myself more time to heal while I pumped.  [Your daughter might take to the shield.] I made matters worse because I did use the bottle as a crutch. But you know how much you worry that you are starving your child and she could really suck a bottle down! I used the Avent too. Then after my nipples healed I felt more confident offering her the breast before or after every feeding and taking the advice given by NOT giving her the bottle. Finally, little by little she would eat at the left breast but flat refuse the right. So, my LLL friend said to go with the favored breast (at least she was nursing). By that point (around week 3) I was offering the left breast whenever she was hungry and pumping the right. If she was fussy at the left breast or so hungry she fought me, I gave her the EBM from the syringe. It just took until she was 2 months old before we "clicked" and didn’t need to supplement. By then she was even nursing from the right breast. (Now the right is her favorite one…LOL.) Try the suggestions Beth gave. Give her the EBM first to help calm her and get nutrition into her. Even if your breast is just a pacifier at first, it’s a beginning. If she is still giving you wet and poopy diapers? (at least 6 wet ones per day)  then she is getting enough bm/food. You cannot judge just by how many ounces she eats at any one feeding. Has she been weighed lately? Gaining weight? Has her color gotten better? Does she eat 8-10 times within a 24 hour period? You can stimulate her if she falls asleep after only a few sips/sucks by feeding her dressed only in a diaper or baring and tickling her feet. Would it be possible to stay in bed bare chested and the baby naked but with a diaper for a few days? One day? Skin-to-skin contact encourages them toward the breast. Also, you can use the pump to get your letdown going before you offer the breast. Then she won’t have to work so hard. And if she slows down or falls asleep, switch to the other breast, then back again if need be. My LLL friend said that sometimes with newborns the switching every few minutes seems to stimulate them. Sorry, I don’t know anything about the SNS. You could try your local LLL, a postpartum doula or LC. You’re doing great….really! Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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Hello all, Just a couple of things I haven’t seen in this thread. 1.  _Always_ offer the breast before she is to the crying stage.  Once they are crying they are so hungry, nothing but immediate gratification will console her.  As soon as she begins rooting is the time.  I wholeheartedly agree with co-sleeping.  It does not have to be "all or nothing" as some people seem to think.  Once breastfeeding is well established she can be moved to a bassinet next to your bed and as she grows, to her own room if that is your desire. 2.  Skin to skin contact!!!  Have Mom go without a shirt as much as possible and babe in just a diaper.  If you must crank up the heat to 80 degrees, do it!  Babies are extremely tactile and pretty much sense everything through their skin.  Use a sling-type baby carrier that will expose as much skin as possible and have Mom carry baby around.  Again, as soon as babe roots or makes other signs, try breastfeeding.  Baby may actually nurse more frequently because she can smell the breastmilk and will realize that food is closeby! Best of luck! Darla Homeschooling Mom to Freya, Alec, and Kelson! Wife to Jim.

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Yes, Jackie I did, but it got progressively better day by day. From entirely eating EBM/formula to only EBM to one nursing session to two nursing sessions and so on. My DD didn’t have a poor suck, she had a fierce one! YIKES! After reading Richard and Lily’s story I think my DD’s mouth was too small also. My pain and her poor latch. We came home from the hospital on day 4 of her life and my nipples were cracked and bleeding, then my milk didn’t come in until like day 6.  The second week of her life I mostly fed her by bottle (fomula and EBM). I was given breast shields to use but she took the bare breast better than the shielded nipple, so I just gave myself more time to heal while I pumped.  [Your daughter might take to the shield.] I made matters worse because I did use the bottle as a crutch. But you know how much you worry that you are starving your child and she could really suck a bottle down! I used the Avent too. Then after my nipples healed I felt more confident offering her the breast before or after every feeding and taking the advice given by NOT giving her the bottle. Finally, little by little she would eat at the left breast but flat refuse the right. So, my LLL friend said to go with the favored breast (at least she was nursing). By that point (around week 3) I was offering the left breast whenever she was hungry and pumping the right. If she was fussy at the left breast or so hungry she fought me, I gave her the EBM from the syringe. It just took until she was 2 months old before we "clicked" and didn’t need to supplement. By then she was even nursing from the right breast. (Now the right is her favorite one…LOL.) Try the suggestions Beth gave. Give her the EBM first to help calm her and get nutrition into her. Even if your breast is just a pacifier at first, it’s a beginning. If she is still giving you wet and poopy diapers? (at least 6 wet ones per day)  then she is getting enough bm/food. You cannot judge just by how many ounces she eats at any one feeding. Has she been weighed lately? Gaining weight? Has her color gotten better? Does she eat 8-10 times within a 24 hour period? You can stimulate her if she falls asleep after only a few sips/sucks by feeding her dressed only in a diaper or baring and tickling her feet. Would it be possible to stay in bed bare chested and the baby naked but with a diaper for a few days? One day? Skin-to-skin contact encourages them toward the breast. Also, you can use the pump to get your letdown going before you offer the breast. Then she won’t have to work so hard. And if she slows down or falls asleep, switch to the other breast, then back again if need be. My LLL friend said that sometimes with newborns the switching every few minutes seems to stimulate them. Sorry, I don’t know anything about the SNS. You could try your local LLL, a postpartum doula or LC. You’re doing great….really! Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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Well, day one is progressing very slowly.  She is only taking a couple of swigs at the breast before getting mad, or she falls asleep.  She slept for three hours this morning after only eating 1.5 oz, which is less than her regular feeding of 2 oz.  I have spent the last four hours fighting to get 4 oz into her.  Finally, she started waking up, but still wasn’t really nursing. You did this for two months?  I feel I am doing something wrong right now. She is letting milk dribble out of her mouth, both from the breast and from the syringe.  But, she is not eating what she normally does. How long should I keep her on the breast before going to the syringe?  I don’t want to starve the child. Also, does anyone know where to get a Supplimental Nursing System?  I have tried the hospital, but they were useless. Jackie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi Jackie, Sorry to hear that you are having nipple confusion so early. I have been in your shoes and it seems a lifetime ago when in reality it was a short 8 months. (My daughter was born by c-section 3/13/02). The first thing that you HAVE to do and it is the hardest, is to NOT give her the bottle. You can feed her with a cup (small paper dixie cup) that can be squeezed to feed her. Or use a syringe (my tool of choice) or a finger feeder. Use your expressed milk and keep pumping to maintain your supply. Keep offering the breast  at each feeding. She will want the source because is frustrating to eat by the other methods. Please try not get discouraged, things can still be turned around. It took me until DD was 2 months old before she was entirely back on the breast. But it has been a breeze and such a joy ever since. I have a bfg group on yahoo with LLL members, regular moms and doula’s who are all there to help. (I’m one of the regular moms <g) Sending you support vibes, Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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Well, in the first place, alt.support.breastfeeding is not that heavily read.  You would be better off posting this request to misc.kids.breastfeeding, which has a lot more traffic.

: I have a ten day old girl who was a sleepy baby.  Of course, the hospital : had us supplement her with formula there, and the lactation consultant : reccomended that we try her at each breast 15 minutes and then move on to : the bottle at each feeding. Well that is three mistakes that the medical advice you got compounded.   1.  supplement so quickly and early.   2.  Limit nursing time before supplementing   3.  Using a bottle for what supplementation is necessary. : She only latched on maybe five times total, and then she started rejecting : the breast entirely.  She would fight being pushed into it, and cry harder. : I didn’t want to get her totally turned off to the breasts, so I backed off : for a while, and posted my problems to the La Leche Leauge.  However, in the : five or six days since my question, I have not had any answers, and she is : getting more and more fixed on the plastic nipple. Your daughter has a serious case of nipple confusion which had led to bottle preference.  IMO, the first thing you are going to have to do to get her back on the breast is to get her OFF the bottle, and it is not going to be easy! The first thing you are going to have to do is to get her off the bottle. I suggest that you replace it with an SNS (supplementary nursing system) or LA (Lact Aid).  Both of these are supplementation devices which forces the baby to nurse as if it is on the breast to receive the supplement, whether it is EBM or formula. Your daughter is not going to like it!  She is going to cry, she is going to complain, and initially she is going to refuse to use it.  But stay with it and don’t give her the bottle.  She will NOT starve herself, and if you are persistent, you can get her onto the SNA or LA as a replacement for the bottle.  This the first step. Second is to get her to active nurse at the breast as much as possible. This is often easiest to do when she is very sleepy, as with the first nursing in the morning, the bedtime nursing, or in the middle of the night. If you are not already co-sleeping with your daughter, I suggest that you do so, and that you simply try to latch her on immediately when she wakes to nurse in the middle of the night.  I would also suggest that when you succeed in getting her to latch on and nurse that you let her nurse as long as she wants to, even it it is 45 minutes or an hour or longer. Finally, I would suggest that you find an ICBLC certified laction consultant. Not all LCs are created equal, and often the ones used in hospitals do not have enough training to successfully treast some breastfeeding problems. : Help! : Jackie Good luck, Larry

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Hi Jackie, Sorry to hear that you are having nipple confusion so early. I have been in your shoes and it seems a lifetime ago when in reality it was a short 8 months. (My daughter was born by c-section 3/13/02). The first thing that you HAVE to do and it is the hardest, is to NOT give her the bottle. You can feed her with a cup (small paper dixie cup) that can be squeezed to feed her. Or use a syringe (my tool of choice) or a finger feeder. Use your expressed milk and keep pumping to maintain your supply. Keep offering the breast  at each feeding. She will want the source because is frustrating to eat by the other methods. Please try not get discouraged, things can still be turned around. It took me until DD was 2 months old before she was entirely back on the breast. But it has been a breeze and such a joy ever since. I have a bfg group on yahoo with LLL members, regular moms and doula’s who are all there to help. (I’m one of the regular moms <g) Sending you support vibes, Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

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Jackie, After a bit of research in my bookmarks, I found Dr. Newman’s website (he is considered the KING of bf!). Below is a link to some notes about a baby girl not latching on. Check out the other stuff on the site, there may be more information you can use there. http://www.bflrc.com/newman/overheads/Not%20Latching%20On-nurse.htm Hang in there and keep pumping! Marvel Join my breastfeeding group! http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BiCC

Response:

Jackie, we are in a very similar situation.  Our baby is 3w+2d today.  After a wonderful vaginal birth (zero med) which greatly exceeded our expectations, she was readmitted at 3 days for elevated bilirubin (at 14.7 mg/dL, not really elevated, we later learned) and excessive weight loss.  She had eaten nothing since birth; her discharge weight, at age 60 hours, was 12% below her birth weight — a loss of over a pound (454g).  In the hospital, against my wishes (unfortunately, I didn’t give a direct order), she was given formula by bottle. We have been pumping, feeding her only breast milk.  We rented a Medela Classic, and found that using it has increased my wife, Lily’s milk production significantly.  We’re stockpiling breast milk in our freezer (in fact, on today’s To-Do list is the purchase of additional storage bags).  If you use a hospital-grade pump (Medela Classic or Medela Lactina, for example), your production will increase.  Mid-grade pumps (Medela Pump In Style) will keep your production from falling, but won’t increase it much.  [Disclaimer: I have nothing to gain by your using Medela pumps; I mention them only because they are the only ones familiar to me.] Two of our lacation consultants (we’ve seen SIX!) recommended using the Avent bottle/nipple, because of the dome base, which will keep her jaw open and lips flared.  We have used an SNS and a Hazelbaker finger feeder. This poor child has had every type of feeding apparatus imagineable in her mouth. Feeding is a time of frustration and tears for us.  We feed her a little, because if she is too hungry, she only cries at the breast, then have her try at the breast.  She cries and squirms, Lily struggles to keep her resolve, and I offer encouragement, feel frustrated at my inability to offer any real help, and simply hope for the best.  These past couple of weeks have been hell. I’m sorry, but clearly, I’m in no position to offer you advice.  I offer you my encouragement and very best wishes. Richard

: I have a ten day old girl who was a sleepy baby.  Of course, the hospital : had us supplement her with formula there, and the lactation consultant : reccomended that we try her at each breast 15 minutes and then move on to : the bottle at each feeding. : She only latched on maybe five times total, and then she started rejecting : the breast entirely.  She would fight being pushed into it, and cry harder. : I didn’t want to get her totally turned off to the breasts, so I backed off : for a while, and posted my problems to the La Leche Leauge.  However, in the : five or six days since my question, I have not had any answers, and she is : getting more and more fixed on the plastic nipple. : Right now I am pumping 95% of the milk she drinks, but this is not going to : last.  Eventually, her appetite will outpace my production. : Help! : Jackie

Response:

I went through something similar with my first.  After the birth, I had hemorraging, and lost quite a bit of blood.  My son was born two weeks early, and was very sleepy.  We ended up going the same route with him as this one, but he never ever latched on.  And, with the pump we rented from the hospital, I never gave out more than 2 oz of milk at a time.  We tried the finger feeding method, but then he wouldn’t take the breast (or a bottle either).  We tried the SNS system, but he was already rejecting breasts by then.  We tried the Avent bottles, but the ones we got dripped if turned upside down, so that was counter-productive.  The Vent-air bottles with the stage 1 nipple are very slow flow, but the shape is the normal bottle nipple shape.  (And, by the time we noticed that with the first baby, he was on bottles full time.) I felt the same way you did, but I couldn’t keep up with it for that long. Between my fatigue from anemia, and my emotional state after my son rejecting my breasts, I decided to go with bottle feeding after two weeks of fighting.  He did just fine with it, but I really did want to breast feed him, so it was always a source of disappointment. I wish you the best of luck.  I am going to be trying Marvel’s suggesting of just using a syringe after the breast starting tomorrow. I do have a Medela Classic now.  It is a very nice pump, and my production is doing well.  I just need to slip in extra pumpings to boost production to store. Jackie

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Jackie, we are in a very similar situation.  Our baby is 3w+2d today. After a wonderful vaginal birth (zero med) which greatly exceeded our expectations, she was readmitted at 3 days for elevated bilirubin (at 14.7 mg/dL, not really elevated, we later learned) and excessive weight loss.  She had eaten nothing since birth; her discharge weight, at age 60 hours, was 12% below her birth weight — a loss of over a pound (454g).  In the hospital, against my wishes (unfortunately, I didn’t give a direct order), she was given formula by bottle. We have been pumping, feeding her only breast milk.  We rented a Medela Classic, and found that using it has increased my wife, Lily’s milk production significantly.  We’re stockpiling breast milk in our freezer (in fact, on today’s To-Do list is the purchase of additional storage bags).  If you use a hospital-grade pump (Medela Classic or Medela Lactina, for example), your production will increase.  Mid-grade pumps (Medela Pump In Style) will keep your production from falling, but won’t increase it much. [Disclaimer: I have nothing to gain by your using Medela pumps; I mention them only because they are the only ones familiar to me.] Two of our lacation consultants (we’ve seen SIX!) recommended using the Avent bottle/nipple, because of the dome base, which will keep her jaw open and lips flared.  We have used an SNS and a Hazelbaker finger feeder. This poor child has had every type of feeding apparatus imagineable in her mouth. Feeding is a time of frustration and tears for us.  We feed her a little, because if she is too hungry, she only cries at the breast, then have her try at the breast.  She cries and squirms, Lily struggles to keep her resolve, and I offer encouragement, feel frustrated at my inability to offer any real help, and simply hope for the best.  These past couple of weeks have been hell. I’m sorry, but clearly, I’m in no position to offer you advice.  I offer you my encouragement and very best wishes. Richard : I have a ten day old girl who was a sleepy baby.  Of course, the hospital : had us supplement her with formula there, and the lactation consultant : reccomended that we try her at each breast 15 minutes and then move on to : the bottle at each feeding. : She only latched on maybe five times total, and then she started rejecting : the breast entirely.  She would fight being pushed into it, and cry harder. : I didn’t want to get her totally turned off to the breasts, so I backed off : for a while, and posted my problems to the La Leche Leauge.  However, in the : five or six days since my question, I have not had any answers, and she is : getting more and more fixed on the plastic nipple. : Right now I am pumping 95% of the milk she drinks, but this is not going to : last.  Eventually, her appetite will outpace my production. : Help! : Jackie

Response:

Gastaldo 'inspired' Bowditch 'Lunatic' award

Question:

"I don’t have any real problem with the issues that interest Dr Gastaldo, and I don’t doubt his sincerity in trying to right what he sees to be a wrong (or several wrongs). It’s just that he has a somewhat unique compositional style which may detract from the message he is trying to convey." –Peter Bowditch http://www.ratbags.com/ranters/gastaldo000218.htm KEY POINT:  The "issues that interest Dr. Gastaldo" involve MDs senselessly inflicting mass human suffering. See Ms. Bell’s penile brutality; Doctor Dick STILL ignores child abuse http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=kslk9.2516%24… 659%40newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net Peter Bowditch is behaving as if he doesn’t have any real problem with MDs inflicting mass human suffering! Peter recently continued his humorous if sordid criticism of my work in discussing Dolf Boek… "One of Mr Boek’s tactics is to complain to ISPs about people who, for example, declare him to be an idiot or call him ‘Dolt’ or ‘Dork’." http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=lli7puk49489o… i343796cgf4v5j%404ax.com Here is Peter discussing his Full Canvas Jacket Unhinged Lunatic Award originally called "The Toddy": "Todd Gastaldo…inspired this site…" http://www.ratbags.com/ranters/howe010515.htm Here is Peter recently comparing Dolf Boek with Todd Gastaldo: "Mr Dolf Boek…a raving loon…posts material which makes Todd Gastaldo look like a paragon of brevity and coherence." http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=lli7puk49489o… i343796cgf4v5j%404ax.com Peter, I write because of your recent inclusion of my name in a sentence about Dolf Boek who you deem to be a "raving loon"… You also still include my name in regard to having inspired your web site about people you deem to be "lunatic." Could you clarify? Are you still just criticizing my "compositional style"? Here’s an account of your previous "compositional style" clarification… BEGIN excerpt of Happy Dog poops on rug (again)

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=Idvv6.418%24O… 26%40paloalto-snr1.gtei.net Peter Bowditch is not an idiot ; but like the rest of us, Peter does do idiotic things on occasion. For example, Peter publicly inferred that I am mentally ill for persistently protesting obvious MD lies and obvious MD-inflicted mass human suffering. When I challenged Peter, he clarified that – by creating the Toddy Award : ) – he wasn’t commenting on the substance of my protests! Later, he indirectly reversed himself by renaming The Toddy the "Full Canvas Jacket Award." END excerpt of Happy Dog poops on rug (again)

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=Idvv6.418%24O… 26%40paloalto-snr1.gtei.net Peter, regarding your criticism that Dolf Boek makes me "look like a paragon of brevity and coherence"… Most of my posts are definitely not brief; so you’ve got me there. But regarding coherence… Surely my posts are no more incoherent (LOOSE, INCONSISTENT) than your "lunatic" site. Main Entry: in

Bottle or breast – new mum in need of advice

Question:

Hi Chell, I assume this is your first baby, in which case, I want to say that YES breastfeeding is very very very hard in the beginning for some people, but that it is worth sticking it out, IMHO.  It took me about a month to get into the swing of things. Be careful about giving lots of bottles, b/c you can dry up and then breastfeeding becomes a far more challenging option (relactating is hard work!). If you need to give bottles to get some rest, could you pump a bit and have your dh give her the expressed breastmilk (EBM) in a bottle?  Then, the formula won’t interfere with your milk supply, which you need to get established. Congrats on your new baby!  The baby blues hopefully won’t last long.  I was in the dumps for about 3 weeks.  Now I love being a mom and I love b-f’ing. (Mine is 6 months, and I have to combo-feed right now, but am working on getting the formula can out of my kitchen.)  I hope that you have as good an experience as I have. Keep us posted on how things are going! Kari M.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi I wonder if someone would be able to give me some unbiased advice.  I have recently given birth to a beautiful baby girl, 8 days ago.  I was finding breastfeeding to be very demanding, but persevered for the first 6 days, but was finding that she was so hungry she would wake up for feeds every 1/2 – 1hr, this left me feeling very drained as I wasn’t getting any sleep, especially after a 38hr long labour.  So the night before last I started to feed her on a bottle, she would then sleep for at least 2 – 3 hrs, sometimes even 4.  The trouble I’m having is I feel very guilty for not giving her the breast, as it was drummed into my head that breast was best.  I’m also suffering from a little baby blues, which doesn’t help :0(.  The question is, is bottle feeding harming my baby?, should I persevere in breastfeeding? I would really appreciate some advice on this matter, and if anyone out there has been experiencing the same problems as me. Thank you in advance Chell

Response:

Hello, I have a 17 month old son that is still nursing. The first couple of weeks were really hard on me, I had the baby blues also, but I kept on nursing and am happy I did, although it’s worth mentioning that breastfeeding forms a strong attachment between mother and baby. My son refused bottled pumped milk when I had to leave him and it frustrated my husband terribly.  I believe that, even though at times it is hard, I have done the best for my son by breastfeeding. I would not trade the bond we have for all the sleep I lost!  You ultimately have to make the right decision for you that will make you a happy mother to your baby! Hope this helps, Laura

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi I wonder if someone would be able to give me some unbiased advice.  I have recently given birth to a beautiful baby girl, 8 days ago.  I was finding breastfeeding to be very demanding, but persevered for the first 6 days, but was finding that she was so hungry she would wake up for feeds every 1/2 – 1hr, this left me feeling very drained as I wasn’t getting any sleep, especially after a 38hr long labour.  So the night before last I started to feed her on a bottle, she would then sleep for at least 2 – 3 hrs, sometimes even 4.  The trouble I’m having is I feel very guilty for not giving her the breast, as it was drummed into my head that breast was best.  I’m also suffering from a little baby blues, which doesn’t help :0(.  The question is, is bottle feeding harming my baby?, should I persevere in breastfeeding? I would really appreciate some advice on this matter, and if anyone out there has been experiencing the same problems as me. Thank you in advance Chell

Response:

Hi I wonder if someone would be able to give me some unbiased advice.  I have recently given birth to a beautiful baby girl, 8 days ago.  I was finding breastfeeding to be very demanding, but persevered for the first 6 days, but was finding that she was so hungry she would wake up for feeds every 1/2 – 1hr, this left me feeling very drained as I wasn’t getting any sleep, especially after a 38hr long labour.  So the night before last I started to feed her on a bottle, she would then sleep for at least 2 – 3 hrs, sometimes even 4.  The trouble I’m having is I feel very guilty for not giving her the breast, as it was drummed into my head that breast was best.  I’m also suffering from a little baby blues, which doesn’t help :0(.  The question is, is bottle feeding harming my baby?, should I persevere in breastfeeding? I would really appreciate some advice on this matter, and if anyone out there has been experiencing the same problems as me. Thank you in advance Chell

Response:

*Hi * *I wonder if someone would be able to give me some unbiased advice.  I have *recently given birth to a beautiful baby girl, 8 days ago.  I was finding *breastfeeding to be very demanding, but persevered for the first 6 days, but *was finding that she was so hungry she would wake up for feeds every 1/2 – *1hr, this left me feeling very drained as I wasn’t getting any sleep, *especially after a 38hr long labour.  So the night before last I started to *feed her on a bottle, she would then sleep for at least 2 – 3 hrs, sometimes *even 4.  The trouble I’m having is I feel very guilty for not giving her the *breast, as it was drummed into my head that breast was best.  I’m also *suffering from a little baby blues, which doesn’t help :0(.  The question *is, is bottle feeding harming my baby?, should I persevere in breastfeeding? *I would really appreciate some advice on this matter, and if anyone out *there has been experiencing the same problems as me. No one can tell you in advance if your baby will be one of the ones who will have a problem with formula, or who will have a problem which could have been ameliorated to some extent by feeding breastmilk. The studies do show that breastmilk is best, but of course if you make yourself physically or mentally ill to the extent you can not care for your daughter by BFing, then you do what you have to do. Now, if you feel you CAN BF but it just is difficult, I urge you to persevere as you clearly have a desire to BF and by persevering you can fulfill that desire and avoid feeling guilty. Perhaps a lactation consultant can help you out? If you really can’t sustain fulltime BFing, what about combi-feeding? BF as often as you can, and FF when you really can’t. —                 "uber vaccae in quattuor partes divisum est."                     newly minted veterinarian-at-large

Response:

new to groups with qn re solids intro

Question:

I wouldn’t worry about solids leading to weaning.  Both my daughters began solids at about 4 mos. and continued to breastfeed with vigour.  If you’re concerned about the advice you got about starting solids though you should seek a second opinion.  Not all health care professionals are as informed about bfing as they should be. Jacqui – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all I’m new to these groups (just became aware of their existence) and have a question re introduction of solids. My daughter is 4 months old and has bad reflux. We’ve been advised to start introducing solids a couple of times a day, a little bit in the middle of feeds, to help with the reflux. I desperately wanted to breastfeed exclusively for at least 6 months. Aside from reflux she is healthy and happy. I have a fantastic supply – too much really – and she feeds well, except when refluxing! She currently gets one bottle of expressed milk per day – so Daddy can have a turn at feeding. My concern is that by introducing solids I am starting the weaning process and I’d intended to breastfeed her for as long as possible, at least a year, maybe two or more; it depends on her and also on whether we’ll go for IVF for a second child. I do NOT want to stop breastfeeding simply because we started solids too early. I am envisioning solids once a day soon becoming solids several times a day and before you know it – she is off the breast! I desperately don’t want that, but, then again, her reflux is bad. Anyone have any experience with giving a little solids once a day at 4 months? Could you still continue to breastfeed for at least a year? BTW, if possible. could you send replies to me personally as well as to the group. I’ve discovered with other groups I frequent that I have many many many missing posts! tia Karen p.s. apologies for the crosspost – wasn’t sure where to send it

Response:

Many thanks for all of the advice and support. I have to say a special thanks to Stonering for that info. I checked out Dr Sears webpage. I’ve never heard of Dr Sears but I thought it was excellent. We’d been struggling to come up with info on reflux, but that was great!! Thanks. K

Response:

said: Many thanks for all of the advice and support. I have to say a special thanks to Stonering for that info. I checked out Dr Sears webpage. I’ve never heard of Dr Sears but I thought it was excellent. We’d been struggling to come up with info on reflux, but that was great!! Thanks. K

posted and emailed again Dr Sears is big in the US, at least with attachment parenting folks, I’d say.  His site is where I look for information when it’s not a desperate situation and I just want to know more (as opposed to calling my Pede in an emergency.) I just remembered that I was going to check the other doctor’s name and information.  It’s Jack Newman.  His book says   "Nothing better demonstrates how the bottle-feeding mentality negatively influences breastfeeding than the physician’s usual approach to dealing with ‘reflux’.  Here is how most physicians would treat a formula fed baby with reflux.  Offer small, frequent feedings. If that doesn’t work then: Add cereal to the bottle.  If that doesn’t work then: Medication." "Thus when faced with a breastfeeding baby exhibiting spitting up and fussiness, most physicians will use the model of the formula feeding baby because that is what they know."   "Most physicians will not watch a mother breastfeed her baby, but if they did they would notice perhaps, that it is extremely uncommon for babies to spit up while they are on the breast.  It does happen that a baby will spit up while still latched on to the breast, but even I who watch thousands of feedings every year, see a baby spit up on the breast once a year or less."         "By applying the bottle feeding model to breastfeeding we give breastfeeding mothers the worst possible advice with regard to dealing with reflux.  The feedings should not be short.  The baby should be on the breast for as long as he’ll hold on to it, even if he is not drinking.  While he sucks there are small waves of muscle contraction in the esophagus in the direction of the stomach, which likely explains why the baby does not spit up while on the breast.  When the baby is getting very little milk at the end of the feeding, little is coming in from up top, and the stomach is emptying.  So when he finally comes off the breast, he will spit up les, or not at all  It’s simple but requires an understanding of breastfeeding." And on a side note, by searching for Newman, Reflux and Baby on Google, I found this page http://www.angelfire.com/ar/reflux/  which is not a Jack Newman page, but evidently mentions him, (found it, he has a link on his articles page to her page) and looks like it has some good information.  I’ll even read it if DD stays busy for long. (read a little, she has negative comments about feeding cereal as a solution for reflux under her FAQ section.)  And she also has some discussion on altering your diet to deal with reflux Also http://www.angelfire.com/ar/reflux/  which has a LLLI article, which says reflux is often confused with problems from an overactive let down.  They mention that some doctors may want you to try giving cereal, but in their regular politically correct manner, they say nothing about whether it’s a good idea or not. Anyway, good luck, and I’d be most interested to hear what happens, what you try, what works, what doesn’t.  It will get better in time. My spitty four month old is now a busy cheerful 14 month old.  :-) — doula, birth radical, parent keeper of sheep and goats I’d prefer peace.

Response:

And on a side note, by searching for Newman, Reflux and Baby on Google, I found this page http://www.angelfire.com/ar/reflux/  which is not a Jack Newman page, but evidently mentions him, (found it, he has a link on his articles page to her page) and looks like it has some good information.  I’ll even read it if DD stays busy for long. (read a little, she has negative comments about feeding cereal as a solution for reflux under her FAQ section.)  

Among other things, that web page says this:         I do not recommend giving your baby cereal to help reflux. I do not believe the         reasoning behind it is sound, and I have yet to find any studies done on its         effectiveness. A very brief search of the medline database turns up studies on the effectivness of cereal [1-2]. To be fair, another study on thickening apple juice found that it didn’t help [3]. These studies were turned up by a simple query on "cereal" and "reflux". [1] J Pediatr 1987 Feb;110(2):181-6 Thickening of infant feedings for therapy of gastroesophageal reflux. Orenstein SR, Magill HL, Brooks P. [2] J Pediatr Gastroenterol Nutr 2000 Nov;31(5):554-6 Smaller volume, thickened formulas in the management of gastroesophageal reflux in thriving infants. Khoshoo V, Ross G, Brown S, Edell D. [3] J Pediatr 1987 Feb;110(2):187-9 Lack of efficacy of thickened feeding as treatment for gastroesophageal reflux. Bailey DJ, Andres JM, Danek GD, Pineiro-Carrero VM.

Response:

Hi there! I’m mom to a 2 year old and a 3 month old. I know lots of women who nurse their toddlers (nearing 2 years) I had to start supplemental formula for my 2 yr old when she was 4 months, and started solids at 5.5 months, when she was nursing every 2 hrs and wanted to nurse every hour. She cried whenever we  ate! I still nursed her once or twice a day till she was 14 months, and stopped mostly because I was pregnant with my second, and had had problems with weight gain in my first pregnancy and found nursing draining. I have every intention of nursing my son until he is well passed 1 yr. Introducing solids is a step in diversifying your child’s diet, and their is no reason not to nurse, too. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all I’m new to these groups (just became aware of their existence) and have a question re introduction of solids. My daughter is 4 months old and has bad reflux. We’ve been advised to start introducing solids a couple of times a day, a little bit in the middle of feeds, to help with the reflux. I desperately wanted to breastfeed exclusively for at least 6 months. Aside from reflux she is healthy and happy. I have a fantastic supply – too much really – and she feeds well, except when refluxing! She currently gets one bottle of expressed milk per day – so Daddy can have a turn at feeding. My concern is that by introducing solids I am starting the weaning process and I’d intended to breastfeed her for as long as possible, at least a year, maybe two or more; it depends on her and also on whether we’ll go for IVF for a second child. I do NOT want to stop breastfeeding simply because we started solids too early. I am envisioning solids once a day soon becoming solids several times a day and before you know it – she is off the breast! I desperately don’t want that, but, then again, her reflux is bad. Anyone have any experience with giving a little solids once a day at 4 months? Could you still continue to breastfeed for at least a year? BTW, if possible. could you send replies to me personally as well as to the group. I’ve discovered with other groups I frequent that I have many many many missing posts! tia Karen p.s. apologies for the crosspost – wasn’t sure where to send it

Response:

<< Introducing solids is a step in diversifying your child’s diet, and their is no reason not to nurse, too. I delayed solids with my sons until six months due to a strong family history of allergies and intend to do the same for my now four-month-old daughter.  She has already developed a little eczema so I am going to have to watch her for allergies.  My sons each nursed until age three and a half; they are 26 months apart so I nursed my oldest all the way through my second pregnancy and then tandem nursed for 17 months.  They are six and four now, so my daughter gets to solo nurse.  :-)   I also work, so I pumped during the first twelve months and after that the boys were given whole milk in my absence while continuing to nurse when I was home. No formula.  The milk and the solids didn’t seem to affect their nursing at all.  Fortunately my job is not office hours though it is fulltime, so I am seldom away from my children more than three or four hours at a time. Mary Ellen

Response:

Hi all I’m new to these groups (just became aware of their existence) and have a question re introduction of solids. My daughter is 4 months old and has bad reflux. We’ve been advised to start introducing solids a couple of times a day, a little bit in the middle of feeds, to help with the reflux. I desperately wanted to breastfeed exclusively for at least 6 months. Aside from reflux she is healthy and happy. I have a fantastic supply – too much really – and she feeds well, except when refluxing! She currently gets one bottle of expressed milk per day – so Daddy can have a turn at feeding. My concern is that by introducing solids I am starting the weaning process and I’d intended to breastfeed her for as long as possible, at least a year, maybe two or more; it depends on her and also on whether we’ll go for IVF for a second child. I do NOT want to stop breastfeeding simply because we started solids too early. I am envisioning solids once a day soon becoming solids several times a day and before you know it – she is off the breast! I desperately don’t want that, but, then again, her reflux is bad. Anyone have any experience with giving a little solids once a day at 4 months? Could you still continue to breastfeed for at least a year? BTW, if possible. could you send replies to me personally as well as to the group. I’ve discovered with other groups I frequent that I have many many many missing posts! tia Karen p.s. apologies for the crosspost – wasn’t sure where to send it

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all I’m new to these groups (just became aware of their existence) and have a question re introduction of solids. My daughter is 4 months old and has bad reflux. We’ve been advised to start introducing solids a couple of times a day, a little bit in the middle of feeds, to help with the reflux. I desperately wanted to breastfeed exclusively for at least 6 months. Aside from reflux she is healthy and happy. I have a fantastic supply – too much really – and she feeds well, except when refluxing! She currently gets one bottle of expressed milk per day – so Daddy can have a turn at feeding.  My concern is that by introducing solids I am starting the weaning process and I’d intended to breastfeed her for as long as possible, at least a year, maybe two or more; it depends on her and also on whether we’ll go for IVF for a second child. I do NOT want to stop breastfeeding simply because we started solids too early.

 i don’t think it would lead to early weaning. my boy is almost 16 months, has been eating solids since 6 months & shows *no* indication he wants to wean.  :)  out of curiousity, why do they recommend solids as a help for the reflux? lee

Response:

Hi all I’m new to these groups (just became aware of their existence) and have a question re introduction of solids. My daughter is 4 months old and has bad reflux. We’ve been advised to start introducing solids a couple of times a day, a little bit in the middle of feeds, to help with the reflux. I desperately wanted to breastfeed exclusively for at least 6 months.

I don’t think it would hurt anything to try it.  Your baby might not want it.  I’ve only known one baby with reflux and the poor thing cried constantly.  She was fine once they started a tiny bit of solids at 4 months.  At any rate, I don’t think you need to be concerned about early weaning.  Most babies still nurse like crazy even if they are getting a few solids.  Babies that self wean usually nurse for *years*!  Just don’t over do it.  Give her enought to calm the reflux and continue to offer the breast as often as she is used to taking it.  Another rule of thumb is to nurse before you offer the solids but I’m not sure if this is appropriate if the solids are given due to reflux? Good luck! Nikki Mama to Hunter 4/26/99 and Luke 4/19/01

Response:

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi all I’m new to these groups (just became aware of their existence) and have a question re introduction of solids. My daughter is 4 months old and has bad reflux. We’ve been advised to start introducing solids a couple of times a day, a little bit in the middle of feeds, to help with the reflux. I desperately wanted to breastfeed exclusively for at least 6 months. Aside from reflux she is healthy and happy. I have a fantastic supply – too much really – and she feeds well, except when refluxing! She currently gets one bottle of expressed milk per day – so Daddy can have a turn at feeding.  My concern is that by introducing solids I am starting the weaning process and I’d intended to breastfeed her for as long as possible, at least a year, maybe two or more; it depends on her and also on whether we’ll go for IVF for a second child. I do NOT want to stop breastfeeding simply because we started solids too early.  i don’t think it would lead to early weaning. my boy is almost 16 months, has been eating solids since 6 months & shows *no* indication he wants to wean.  :)  out of curiousity, why do they recommend solids as a help for the reflux?

Yeah, I wondered the same thing?  My first thought was that different foods, more difficult to digest, might make things worse.  Dunno… My daughter is 23 months, started solids at 5 months, and still breastfeeds like crazy.  I think the comfort factor keeps them hooked.  : ) Lisa

Response:

a weaning question

Question:

I have never used this product but here is a link to an organic soy based formula.  I think this would be a better idea than using enriched rice milk. http://www.naturesone.com/soy.htm Jocelyn Mommy to Ren

shouldn't the dad give bottle sometimes?

Question:

My wife is nurisng our child.  I’m happy she is doing so.  But isn’t it fair if the dad takes a bottle and feeds the baby once in a while?  Or will it confuse the baby.  I’m talking feeding a bottle with the mother’s milk. Thanks

Response:

Hi – When the baby has established agood nursing pattern, and mom’s milk supply is in good shape (4-6 weeks of age for the baby) then it’s fine to start on bottles (of EBM — expressed breast milk) if you want.  In fact, mom maycrave a break at that point and be grateful for the occasional bottle!  It’s a good age to stat a daily bottle anyway, in order to get and keep the baby used to nursing from a bottle as well as the breast.  (It gives you flexibility in case you want to go out without the baby, or in case your wife should become ill or injured and unable to nurse for a time.) That said, if dad wants to bond with the baby, he’s probably better off taking over OTHER activities and making them his own.  Baths, or night diaper changes, and certainly evening strolls to the playground (to watch the other kids, at this point) are good choices for an involved dad and will help you bond with the baby, and help the baby fall in love with YOU.   My husband did most of the night diapers for the first 6 months of both kids’ lives (for which I am SILL grateful), and used to be responsible for baths until his evening schedule went out of his control.  He started taking the kids out for evening and weekend strolls, trips to the playground, etc, when they were quite small, and has kept the habit up.  These forms of interaction have been completely wonderful for all involved.  He rarely offered a bottle and no one has ever missed that. (He did get to offer the first few solid meals, which he enjoyed.  I took over again once solids became routine.) "Fair" doesn’t really have anything to do with bottle feeding per se. Working things out with your wife to your mutual satisfaction, though, is very important.  Figure out WHY you want so badly to offer the occasional bottle, and WHY she might not wish you to do so.  Keep talking until you’re both happy with the result.  THAT is what is the most fair thing to do.  (Remember that adding a baby to the family is very stressful, for BOTH parents, and not for the reasons that you may have expected. It’s the change in family dynamics that is the most challengin, I thinkk.) I’ve gone on too long, but I hope this has helped, –Beth Kevles   http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html — a page for the milk-allergic   Disclaimer:  Nothing in this message should be construed as medical   advice.  Please consult with your own medical practicioner.

Response:

My wife is nurisng our child.  I’m happy she is doing so.  But isn’t it fair if the dad takes a bottle and feeds the baby once in a while?  Or will it confuse the baby.  I’m talking feeding a bottle with the mother’s milk. Thanks

Generally speaking, baby care *isn’t* fair. That said, I don’t understand why so many fathers are so hung up on being able to give the baby a bottle when there are so many other options for interacting with your baby. When you’re giving the baby a bottle, the baby is pretty much concentrating on eating. To have more of his attention, take your little one in the bath or shower with you, take him on walks (giving mom a break, which is usually appreciated right before dinner — it’s tough to cook when the baby is crying!), rock and sing to him, play on the floor. Your wife needs you to support her 100% in regard to breastfeeding. She’s doing the best thing for your child. If you expect that the baby will need to have bottles at some point (your wife is going back to work), you can help introduce the bottle when he’s 4-6 weeks old, since it’s easier for dad to do it than mom. Introducing the bottle before that can lead to nipple confusion and the baby refusing to nurse. Please keep in mind too that in order to fill that bottle with expressed breast milk, your wife will have to learn to either manually express milk or pump. Both can take a lot of effort, so you might want to ask yourself if it’s "fair" of you to expect your wife to pump/express so that you can give the baby a bottle. Now is the time to focus on the *baby’s* needs, rather than your wants. Find other ways to enjoy your child and you and your family will reap the rewards of a successful nursing relationship. Tracy

Response:

My wife is nurisng our child.  I’m happy she is doing so.  But isn’t it fair if the dad takes a bottle and feeds the baby once in a while?  Or will it confuse the baby.  I’m talking feeding a bottle with the mother’s milk.

You don’t say how old the baby is.  If baby is less than 6-8 weeks old, a bottle is not a good idea. It CAN, as you note, confuse the baby. After about 6 weeks, an occassional (once a day or less) bottle of EBM should not be a problem for most babies.  However, if you are wanting time with the baby, there are PLENTY of things you can do that don’t involve feeding. (And dont’ require mom to spend time with a breast pump just so you can feed the baby.)  You can: Play with the baby Rock the baby Sing to the baby Dress the baby Bathe the baby Change baby’s diapers Talk to the baby Take baby for a walk in a stroller or sling Put baby to bed Pick baby up and bring him/her to mother for night feeds (and return baby to bed afterwards). Once baby is on solids, you will also have ample opportunity to feed the baby. Please consider baby’s needs, and those of your wife, before your own wish to feed the baby. Naomi

Response:

Too bad the babies grandmother is doing all those things. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife is nurisng our child.  I’m happy she is doing so.  But isn’t it fair if the dad takes a bottle and feeds the baby once in a while?  Or will it confuse the baby.  I’m talking feeding a bottle with the mother’s milk. You don’t say how old the baby is.  If baby is less than 6-8 weeks old, a bottle is not a good idea. It CAN, as you note, confuse the baby. After about 6 weeks, an occassional (once a day or less) bottle of EBM should not be a problem for most babies.  However, if you are wanting time with the baby, there are PLENTY of things you can do that don’t involve feeding. (And dont’ require mom to spend time with a breast pump just so you can feed the baby.)  You can: Play with the baby Rock the baby Sing to the baby Dress the baby Bathe the baby Change baby’s diapers Talk to the baby Take baby for a walk in a stroller or sling Put baby to bed Pick baby up and bring him/her to mother for night feeds (and return baby to bed afterwards). Once baby is on solids, you will also have ample opportunity to feed the baby. Please consider baby’s needs, and those of your wife, before your own wish to feed the baby. Naomi

Response:

If grandma is pre-empting the tasks that YOU would like to be doing in order to bond with the baby, then tell her that YOU would like to do (pick whichever suits you), and let her know that you feel left out. Talk to your wife about feeling left out, too.  Now is a good time to set up a family dynamic that works for ALL of you. Make sure your wife understand how important it is that you spend time with the baby.  Don’t hesitate to take the baby from your wife AFTER nursing so that you can do the burping, or to gently nudge grandma aside so that you can nap snuggled with the baby, or change the diaper or whatever.  (You can make grandma feel pretty good by having her watch you do thburping and diapers to make sure you’re doing them right, even if you already feel confident.) Do whatever it takes so that YOU canenjoy your new baby as much as everyone else does.  I have such wonderful memories of my husband napping with a newborn asleep in the crook of his arm… –Beth Kevles   http://web.mit.edu/kevles/www/nomilk.html — a page for the milk-allergic   Disclaimer:  Nothing in this message should be construed as medical   advice.  Please consult with your own medical practicioner.

Response:

Chris, as the mom of three breastfed kids, I’ll honestly tell you I dunno why you would want to give a kid a bottle (an artificial breast substitute). You aren’t a replacement mom, you are a dad and you need to figure out your own niche. Sure, as mom, I had the market cornered on feeding for the first 6 months, seeing how I was both the manufacturer and the dispenser, but heck, that is just one part of a baby’s life. There are a zillion things you can do to be a close, involved dad at this stage. My husband took over bath time, and loved it – it is actually a great job for dad, since it is so much fun, and so close and loving. He also took babies for long walks, played with them, walked the floor, cuddled, changed, dressed, burped, take naps with them, you name it. Once we got to solids, he got to shovel food into them as well – an activity of limited charm, if you ask me!! My kids have all gone through periods when they preferred mom, and periods when they preferred dad. Your time will come!! Mary G.

Response:

Tracy,     I can see why he (CJL) felt "pissed off " as you put it.  CJL asked a simple series questions and you talked not only down to him, but made it seem as if he were a jerk or something for wanting his needs filled.  Family is about all members, isn’t it?  I do agree with your thoughts on nipple confusion etc.  My opinion, for what it’s worth, is you could have put it little nicer.  thanx for reading my post.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife is nurisng our child.  I’m happy she is doing so.  But isn’t it fair if the dad takes a bottle and feeds the baby once in a while?  Or will it confuse the baby.  I’m talking feeding a bottle with the mother’s milk. Thanks Generally speaking, baby care *isn’t* fair. That said, I don’t understand why so many fathers are so hung up on being able to give the baby a bottle when there are so many other options for interacting with your baby. When you’re giving the baby a bottle, the baby is pretty much concentrating on eating. To have more of his attention, take your little one in the bath or shower with you, take him on walks (giving mom a break, which is usually appreciated right before dinner — it’s tough to cook when the baby is crying!), rock and sing to him, play on the floor. Your wife needs you to support her 100% in regard to breastfeeding. She’s doing the best thing for your child. If you expect that the baby will need to have bottles at some point (your wife is going back to work), you can help introduce the bottle when he’s 4-6 weeks old, since it’s easier for dad to do it than mom. Introducing the bottle before that can lead to nipple confusion and the baby refusing to nurse. Please keep in mind too that in order to fill that bottle with expressed breast milk, your wife will have to learn to either manually express milk or pump. Both can take a lot of effort, so you might want to ask yourself if it’s "fair" of you to expect your wife to pump/express so that you can give the baby a bottle. Now is the time to focus on the *baby’s* needs, rather than your wants. Find other ways to enjoy your child and you and your family will reap the rewards of a successful nursing relationship. Tracy

Response:

bottles intruduced can cause nipple confusion and as I found with my premie, it caused me MONTHS of sadness and heartache to try to breastfeed and bottle feed. my husband now spends his quality time with our new guy changing diapers, giving baths, cuddling, carrying, and running and fetching, feeding is just such a tiny part of parenting that it was just too hard on both me and my baby that we opted not to confuse the situation again with the last two babies. Katherine (Houston) Magnus EDD 6.19.01-7.4.01 Erik 9.29.99 Naomi 12.7.90 Krystal 9.25.85 Jasmine 9.25.85 http://www.ausome.com/family

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife is nurisng our child.  I’m happy she is doing so.  But isn’t it fair if the dad takes a bottle and feeds the baby once in a while?  Or will it confuse the baby.  I’m talking feeding a bottle with the mother’s milk. Thanks

Response:

We found that we had to give a bottle, unfortunatly, within the magic 6 weeks time period.  My son went tru a little nipple confusion, but he sorted it out quickly. Best not to give a bottle in the first 6 weeks, because BF is just being established. Babies are not born with the muscle development they need to brestfeed succesfully. They never had a chance to use those muscles before, so it takes effort on thier behalf, first to figure out how to get the milk to come, and second, to build up muscle tone.  A botlle drips the milk into thier mouth, and doesn’t complian when chomped on.  After the 6 week period, most babies have figured out the way to nurse that doesn’t have mom yelling "ouch", and delatching them. Good luck. Terri "Katherine WretchedHeathen" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – bottles intruduced can cause nipple confusion and as I found with my premie, it caused me MONTHS of sadness and heartache to try to breastfeed and bottle feed. my husband now spends his quality time with our new guy changing diapers, giving baths, cuddling, carrying, and running and fetching, feeding is just such a tiny part of parenting that it was just too hard on both me and my baby that we opted not to confuse the situation again with the last two babies. "C.J.L" My wife is nurisng our child.  I’m happy she is doing so.  But isn’t it fair if the dad takes a bottle and feeds the baby once in a while?  Or will it confuse the baby.  I’m talking feeding a bottle with the mother’s milk. Thanks

Response:

THIS IS A REHASH OF SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED MONTHS AGO?  Oooopsss.  Caps lock stuck.  NOT. Tracy, why do you not consider that the MAN, is trying to be fair with his wife so she gets a break or something.  You just snap judgment to the FACT that he is feeling put upon.  That may not be the case……  I hate to call anyone a bitch, so I won’t. Regards,

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My wife is nurisng our child.  I’m happy she is doing so.  But isn’t it fair if the dad takes a bottle and feeds the baby once in a while?  Or will it confuse the baby.  I’m talking feeding a bottle with the mother’s milk. Thanks Generally speaking, baby care *isn’t* fair. That said, I don’t understand why so many fathers are so hung up on being able to give the baby a bottle when there are so many other options for interacting with your baby. When you’re giving the baby a bottle, the baby is pretty much concentrating on eating. To have more of his attention, take your little one in the bath or shower with you, take him on walks (giving mom a break, which is usually appreciated right before dinner — it’s tough to cook when the baby is crying!), rock and sing to him, play on the floor. Your wife needs you to support her 100% in regard to breastfeeding. She’s doing the best thing for your child. If you expect that the baby will need to have bottles at some point (your wife is going back to work), you can help introduce the bottle when he’s 4-6 weeks old, since it’s easier for dad to do it than mom. Introducing the bottle before that can lead to nipple confusion and the baby refusing to nurse. Please keep in mind too that in order to fill that bottle with expressed breast milk, your wife will have to learn to either manually express milk or pump. Both can take a lot of effort, so you might want to ask yourself if it’s "fair" of you to expect your wife to pump/express so that you can give the baby a bottle. Now is the time to focus on the *baby’s* needs, rather than your wants. Find other ways to enjoy your child and you and your family will reap the rewards of a successful nursing relationship. Tracy

Response:

Daughter won't take EBM from bottle

Question:

My 2nd daughter, now 4 months, WILL NOT touch a bottle.  Having 2 kids, with the older one being a toddler, my dh and myself would love to get out to have a decent chat once in a while.  However, my dd spies the bottle and….that’s it.  Cries and refuses – turns head, pushes bottle away – you name it, she does it.  Others have tried giving her a bottle too, and at different times of day.  No luck.  I left her with my mom once – she was hungry for 2 hours before we got home, and wouldn’t drink a drop from the bottle.  (Not that I was happy that my mom hadn’t called me home to feed her, but that’s another issue completely!!)  We’ve also tried different teats etc to no avail.  Any ideas? — Mandy Mom to Dana DOB 23/9/1998 and Heather  DOB 22/9/2000

Response:

Hi Mandy,     I also have a 4 month old.  My son, who used to get 2 – 3 bottles of EBM a week (from my Mom) has lately been refusing them as well. I teach part-time, and had nearly a month off at Christmas, during which time he didn’t have any bottles.  His hunger strike started after I started back this January.  The longest he’s gone without eating is 6 – 7 hours (5 a.m. to noon).     My feeling is that, at 4 months, he knows his preferred milk supplier (ie., myself!) will return if he just waits it out.  He took a bottle willingly enough for the first 3 months.  So, I don’t worry about it too much.  If he’s really, really hungry, he’ll eat.  Has your daughter been particularly unhappy (wailing, etc.) or is she just not eating?  The impression I get from my Mom is that my son just seems resigned to waiting — not happy about it, but not a basket case.     You could also have the sitter try feeding from a spoon (gave my son too much gas) or a sippy cup, which I haven’t yet tried.  Maybe the bottle is too obviously a "substitute breast"  - and she’s indignant about it!     Might also make a difference if the milk is pumped fresh (i.e., not frozen and thawed).  Back in the days when he would take a bottle, I noticed my son seemed to prefer it fresh — I’d just pump in the morning and leave it out for the 2 hours or so before he’d want to eat.     Good luck — I hope you make it out for Valentine’s Day! Katie (and Jonathan, 9/17/00)

Response:

My 2nd daughter, now 4 months, WILL NOT touch a bottle.  Having 2 kids, with the older one being a toddler, my dh and myself would love to get out to have a decent chat once in a while.  However, my dd spies the bottle and….that’s it.  Cries and refuses – turns head, pushes bottle away – you name it, she does it.

What to do depends upon your needs. Parents of babies who have to WOH ft, have found that after offering the bottle every day for some period of time (about two weeks), generally the baby takes it.  Might take it reluctantly — might take very little during the day and make it up with massive nursing at night — but will take it. Parents who just want an occasional outing might find it easier to give EMM using a medicine dropper, syringe, spoon, or cup. These are all slower than a bottle and less efficient, but they all work to get food into a hungry baby. There are cup-feeding instructions at http://www.breastfeeding.org (in the professional section, I think). By 6 mos, my dd was able to drink water pretty well from a plain sippy cup (w/out no-spill valve) so you might want to try that too. HTH, Sydney

Response:

I have a 3 1/2 month old that I had a terrible time of teaching to take EBM from a bottle.  I know exactly what you’re going through.  We tried for 4 weeks with all sorts of bottles, nipples, people, techniques.  She cried, fussed, turned her head, pushed the bottle away, and got so upset that she cried herself to sleep.  I’ll tell you what others have told me: 1.  try having someone other than yourself give her the bottle (she knows you have the "goods" so she’ll hold out for it), 2.  try various nipples that most resemble you  3.  Try a squige of Karo light syrup in the bottle or on the nipple 4.  Put A bit of EBM on the tip of the nipple   5. Try putting a bit of sugar on the tip of the nipple 6.  BE PATIENT!!!  Babies can sense your anxiety and she will get frustrated if you are too! After all that, suddenly one day she decided it was time to take the bottle out of the blue with an ordinary bottle of EBM and a run-of-the-mill nipple and no fancy techniques from my husband.  From that day on, she has been bottle feeding a few times a day and taking the breast with no problems between the two. What I learned….she’ll take the bottle when she’s good and ready! Good Luck! Deb Mommy to Deanna Nicole (10/8/00) – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My 2nd daughter, now 4 months, WILL NOT touch a bottle.  Having 2 kids, with the older one being a toddler, my dh and myself would love to get out to have a decent chat once in a while.  However, my dd spies the bottle and….that’s it.  Cries and refuses – turns head, pushes bottle away – you name it, she does it.  Others have tried giving her a bottle too, and at different times of day.  No luck.  I left her with my mom once – she was hungry for 2 hours before we got home, and wouldn’t drink a drop from the bottle.  (Not that I was happy that my mom hadn’t called me home to feed her, but that’s another issue completely!!)  We’ve also tried different teats etc to no avail.  Any ideas? — Mandy Mom to Dana DOB 23/9/1998 and Heather  DOB 22/9/2000

  deborah.gilman.vcf

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Response:

dilemma

Question:

My girlf friend just had our baby.  She does not want to breast feed. All of my other children have been breast feed and I demand it! She has been pumping and dumping!  She says she wants to lose weight but not to breast feed.  So she will pump it and poor it out. I want to start feeding the bady her milk via bottle.  She refuses, she says formula is more nutritious.  Further she says she will not no if our daughter is eating enough with out bottles. I have spoken to DCFS in Illinois.  They say there is nothing wrong with bottle feeding.  She does not work and still not breast feed.  If the state won’t help me what can Dr. Goldblatt do? I want my child eating her milk!  Please advise Shalom, — =-= Leland Milton Goldblatt, Ph.D. The Doctor’s homepage:  http://www.goldblatt.faithweb.com

Response:

Don’t bother replying, folks–this is a TROLL.

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – My girlf friend just had our baby.  She does not want to breast feed. All of my other children have been breast feed and I demand it! She has been pumping and dumping!  She says she wants to lose weight but not to breast feed.  So she will pump it and poor it out. I want to start feeding the bady her milk via bottle.  She refuses, she says formula is more nutritious.  Further she says she will not no if our daughter is eating enough with out bottles. I have spoken to DCFS in Illinois.  They say there is nothing wrong with bottle feeding.  She does not work and still not breast feed.  If the state won’t help me what can Dr. Goldblatt do? I want my child eating her milk!  Please advise Shalom, — =-= Leland Milton Goldblatt, Ph.D. The Doctor’s homepage:  http://www.goldblatt.faithweb.com

Response:

How to feed Bottle to baby who does not want it.

Question:

Hi, I have an 11 week old son who has had a few bottles (EBM). He was fine with a bottle (we gave him one about once a week sometimes twice a week since he was four weeks) He would drink the whole bottle fine. In the last two weeks he has refused to drink more than a few sips from a bottle. He screams and chokes and spits the nipple out. My question is do I just keep trying to give the bottle? Maybe once a day? and if so do I offer a breast after the bottle? before the bottle? No breast at all even if he declines the bottle completely? This may be a dumb question but… do I need to express milk if he is given a bottle for practice and I am there, in order to keep my supply up or will missing one feeding not hurt?? I do not want to mess up my supply as I have worked hard to get it up to where it is now. I need to start working and may miss a feeding once in a while and so would love him to take the bottle easier. Also, I am in the Raleigh, NC area and have extra frozen EBM if there is anyone who is need in the area. I hear it keeps for three months frozen and I will be needing to get rid of some soon. Debbie and Ryan

Response:

Can I just say, this is so sad?     Sad for the poor baby who wants his mama’s nipple and sad for the mama who has to go back to work.   Sorry I have no advice, good luck though. Norma

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I have an 11 week old son who has had a few bottles (EBM). He was fine with a bottle (we gave him one about once a week sometimes twice a week since he was four weeks) He would drink the whole bottle fine. In the last two weeks he has refused to drink more than a few sips from a bottle. He screams and chokes and spits the nipple out. My question is do I just keep trying to give the bottle? Maybe once a day? and if so do I offer a breast after the bottle? before the bottle? No breast at all even if he declines the bottle completely? This may be a dumb question but… do I need to express milk if he is given a bottle for practice and I am there, in order to keep my supply up or will missing one feeding not hurt?? I do not want to mess up my supply as I have worked hard to get it up to where it is now. I need to start working and may miss a feeding once in a while and so would love him to take the bottle easier. Also, I am in the Raleigh, NC area and have extra frozen EBM if there is anyone who is need in the area. I hear it keeps for three months frozen and I will be needing to get rid of some soon. Debbie and Ryan

Response:

I have no advice for you, but I know how you must be feeling about going back to work and worrying about your supply.  I have to go back to work next week and I don’t have enough milk pumped because I was having trouble pumping for awhile.  (my ds would eat on both sides and take a formula supplement, but when I would try to pump, I wouldn’t get much of anything. I guess my supply was low, but now I am pumping easier, but it’s a little late to stock up.) Also, I am having a lot of anxieties about going back to work.  I am afraid I’m going to miss my ds terribly, and that he will miss me too.  luckily, his daddy will be home during the day. Please let me know how it goes (the bottle feeding and the going back to work)  Unfortunately, I had the opposite problem for a while.  My son wanted the bottle, but not my nipple (it was flat).  I literally had to wrestle with him to stay latched on for a time, which is another reason I’m low on frozen milk now. Also, I had no idea you could donate breast milk!  wow, is it really safe? I would like to hear more about that if anyone has info on it. Egglian

– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Hi, I have an 11 week old son who has had a few bottles (EBM). He was fine with a bottle (we gave him one about once a week sometimes twice a week since he was four weeks) He would drink the whole bottle fine. In the last two weeks he has refused to drink more than a few sips from a bottle. He screams and chokes and spits the nipple out. My question is do I just keep trying to give the bottle? Maybe once a day? and if so do I offer a breast after the bottle? before the bottle? No breast at all even if he declines the bottle completely? This may be a dumb question but… do I need to express milk if he is given a bottle for practice and I am there, in order to keep my supply up or will missing one feeding not hurt?? I do not want to mess up my supply as I have worked hard to get it up to where it is now. I need to start working and may miss a feeding once in a while and so would love him to take the bottle easier. Also, I am in the Raleigh, NC area and have extra frozen EBM if there is anyone who is need in the area. I hear it keeps for three months frozen and I will be needing to get rid of some soon. Debbie and Ryan

Response:

It isn’t clear in your post, so I’ll ask.  Are you the one giving him the bottle? We found that DS would take the bottle better from ANYONE else but me. Other then that, I don’t know.  Good luck, I hope things work out. Terri "Debra Ramsey-Boz" – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In the last two weeks he has refused to drink more than a few sips from a bottle. He screams and chokes and spits the nipple out. My question is do I just keep trying to give the bottle? Maybe once a day? and if so do I offer a breast after the bottle? before the bottle? No breast at all even if he declines the bottle completely?

Response:

Hi Terri, Both my husband and I get the same results, however, we have found that we can sneak about 2 oz in a bottle to him during a night feeding, by the time he wakes up enough to know it’s not a real nipple he’s finished and I top him off with a little real nipple till he falls back asleep. Still no luck with daytime feedings – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It isn’t clear in your post, so I’ll ask.  Are you the one giving him the bottle? We found that DS would take the bottle better from ANYONE else but me. Other then that, I don’t know.  Good luck, I hope things work out. Terri "Debra Ramsey-Boz" In the last two weeks he has refused to drink more than a few sips from a bottle. He screams and chokes and spits the nipple out. My question is do I just keep trying to give the bottle? Maybe once a day? and if so do I offer a breast after the bottle? before the bottle? No breast at all even if he declines the bottle completely?

Response:

I was told by one of the nurses in the hospital where I had David, that she belived that a baby could smell his mother, and the scent of her milk.  I was pretty out of it at the time, or I’d have asked more, but it seems to me, that if this is true, you may have to leave the room, or even the house.  Maybe go for a shower, or a bath. Leave someone else to feed the little one.  I know how hard it can be.  For a couple of weeks, while we were testing David for lactose intolerance, I couldn’t feed him at all.  EBM and lactose free formula in a bottle.  There were times I had to leave the house for my own sanity, ’cause he kept looking for me…… It nearly broke my heart. Do you have public health nurses in your area?  You might give them a call. Best of luck to you and yours. Terri

Response:

I must have missed this, but why do you want to feed your baby with a bottle when he obviously prefers you?  And as someone else mentioned, the baby can smell your breasts, so you may have to leave when any kind of bottle is offered. Stephanie

Response:

I have to get him to take a bottle so that when I am away working he can eat… couple of ozs and then a nursing on the breast after. He is now taking a bottle about 60 percent of the time. I have had more success than my husband, but then I started having more success when I started giving the bottle in nearly the same position as  I have him in when he is nursing. My husband has more success when he holds him the same way. Debbie and Ryan – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -I must have missed this, but why do you want to feed your baby with a bottle when he obviously prefers you?  And as someone else mentioned, the baby can smell your breasts, so you may have to leave when any kind of bottle is offered. Stephanie

Response: